In an email message sent to Obama Conspiracy Theories, Orly Taitz has done, in my mind, the most dangerous and monumentally irresponsible thing so far, trying to tangle up the national response to the swine flu threat in her obsessive fantasies about President Obama. She concluded her letter:
I think we should not be taking those shots [swine flu immunizations], we should not allow our children to be immunized with those shots, there has to be a serious criminal investigation by the military into the epidemiology of those cases at the 29th Palms Marine base, which is also a known FEMA camp.
She cites what is generally considered an overreaction to the swine flu threat in 1976 (where I was a clinic manager in one of the mass immunization clinics, and Orly was still in the Soviet Union). The public health community takes into account the 1976 experience when formulating its recommendations. If the professionals of the CDC recommend vaccinations, then you can be assured that these recommendations are the best that anybody has. Parents would be playing with their childrens’ lives by taking the premature, inexpert, politically motivated recommendations of a raving lunatic dentist instead of the real professionals who make the study of epidemiology and the risks and benefits of vaccination their life’s work.
For responsible and professional information about Swine Flu, please see the new Influenza information link here.
How did I know that the Obama birthers would pick up on the Swine Flu panic ?
Well, now the conspirators include the people who run the CDC and our public health agencies.
This is a prime example of Obots running amok just because they can. Orly means nothing to anybody, yet you sick, twisted people try to make an issue where there is none.
All he has to do is SHOW THE DAMN THING!
This just in…
THE ONE’S long form BC has Swine Flu and is quarantined indefinitely.
How many people did you kill in 1976 when you gave them that ridiculous swine flu vaccine?
Do you think you have better discernment now then you did then?
Or are you still pushing a load of BS that will only kill Americans?
Think about it, won’t you? Thank you.
during my childhood I lost a lot of friends to Chicken Pox, Measles, Rheumatic Fever and Polio. My brother was paralyzed and my heart was damaged by reumatic fever. There was an Iron Lung on every block, everyone was affected. Then the vaccines came, and these scourges were halted. Some of you want to go back to those days of pain. Strange!
if you don’t know what an iron lung was,look here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_lung
You forgot to tell us how many people you killed whom took your swine flu shots. Numbers, please.
Fred, we all have 20/20 hindsight. The 1976 Swine Flu strain was similar to the virus that in 1918 killed 50,000,000 people in a world-wide pandemic. That’s 50 MILLION.
It turns out that the virus didn’t spread beyond a couple hundred cases. But with every vaccine program, there are calculated risks and benefits. The common DTP vaccine required for every school child in America kills some. But it saves many more.
A good article on the 1976 Swine Flu experience is here:
http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/eid/vol12no01/05-1007.htm
The swine flu response in 1976 is a case study for modern epidemiologists. So yes, discernment is better today. I think the consensus is that the 1976 mass immunization program for Swine Flu was launched prematurely. That said, the current Swine Flu outbreak has already outstripped what happened in 1976.
Orly evaluates only one side of the risk/benefit equation, so naturally she will always get the answer wrong.
As for me personally, the chance that anyone died from vaccinations at the clinic I ran (as an administrator, not a doctor) are vanishingly small.
lol. OK, that was a good one.
Actually he did answer that Fred, apparently you just didn’t like the answer.
“the chance that anyone died from vaccinations at the clinic I ran”
Let me ask you this Fred- have you ever read about the 1918 Flu Epedimic? Chances are, you have a family member who died from it- I know my great grandfather died from it, leaving a 23 year old widow to raise a family of four on her own.
You want to risk your family’s health based upon the rantings of some quack fine, but I will rely upon the best medical advise availible at the time. My daugher is vacinated for chicken pox, measles, polio and a host of other things. If the CDC recommends this vaccine for my family, I will take the incredibly small chance that we might get harmed by the vaccine over the larger chance that my daughter will die from Swine Flu. Nothing is without risk. The point is making informed choices, and where you choose to get your information from
Look at the time of the comments. Pay attention or shut up!
Are all liberals that indignant or just the ones from SF?
It’s not going to happen Heavy. You guys are making an issue where there is none.
You’re kidding!
You nutbags have already made up the story that it’s being forged in Canada.
Oh, it’s gonna happen my friend. And when it does, all bets are off!
Heavy- Where is all this argue coming from? Why can’t you have a civil conversation and not attack anyone?
he is not a “right winger”
he is a “right whiner”
they have two character flaws
1. they whine, whine, and whine!
2. they hate, hate and hate!
everything wrong in their miserable lives is someone else’s fault (usually “libs”), they are allergic to personal responsibility as well as knowledge. It’s kind of like when they hated blacks, to divert from their poor life’s, all problems were the black’s fault. Most Birthers are racist, at least the ones I met. By heavy’s language, he certainly fits the mold, as he whines, hates and doesn’t like blacks (especially Obama).
Now you’re trying to put words in my mouth, Richie. Feeling a little guilty. I’m not the hater, you are. You are the racist who tried to make up for years of hate with one vote. Guess what? It didn’t work!
To richCares:
You forgot about the “secular humanists” The evangelicals tried to work up hatred for them a few years back but it petered out. It was too abstract. Heavy has just shown it is still popular to hate gays and Mexicans. When you are a nobody like heavy you need to hate at least one group to feel better about yourself.
You know i think H is trying to get banned so the birthers can claim we do exactly what they do on there site (i cant believe someone can be filled with so much hate, i recall when he said he hated everyone that voted for Obama !!!), unfortunately we don’t roll like that, bad & unnecessary will be removed but it will take more than that for Doc to ban him, he needs to try harder
I thought of a good title for Orly:
“Regina Barathri”
(Queen of the Abyss)
I think it is very appropriate. She seems Hell-bent on dragging America into the Abyss. Looking at her latest pronouncement she seems to be calling for America to disintegrate and being reformed into a country run by a military junta. Ordinary citizens will not be permitted to vote. We would be like Franco’s Spain or Mussolini’s Italy.
There is no need to ban him or anyone else. You see but not see and continue. As soon as I see his name I move to the next post. I do not even read his posts anymore.
As a general principle, even when someone is intentionally trying to get banned, engaging folks in dialog is more productive and more effective than banning.
Ever notice the libs are the ONLY ones to play the race card? White liberal guilt is what created this mess. Now it’s up to everyone else to clean it up.
You people are sick. Sick people belong in hospitals.
Reply to Heavy when he is discussing an issue. Don’t reply when he makes statements about others. I teach preschool and children love the power of certain words. Sometimes the best action is to quietly turn away and ignore it. I am ,of course, talking about words he uses that he hopes generate a response.
Mary, hon, I’ve seen all the responses you people can come up with. NONE of them make sense or hold water. I just like to see what the “Excuse of the day” is. It amuses me and helps me to deal with you sick people.
“Those who can, do. Those who can’t, teach”.
I bet that if the parents of the children you teach were aware of you social and political views, they would not let you anywhere near their children.
I have read this site for a while and I find it interesting that the “birthers” always claim that the rightfully elected President needs to prove that he is a citizen. As I recall since we live in America it is incumbent on the individuals claiming that he is not a citizen to prove that he was born somewhere else. All of the so called “evidence”, the tape of his grandmother, the online BC, his school record in Indonesia (where by the way it says born in Honolulu), has be refuted with hard evidence by many including Dr. C. If if we go along with the forged argument for a second we have been provided with any evidence to support that he was born in another country. I have been waiting for months for some sort of tangible evidence that disputes him being born in HI. And here in NY I 2 years ago had to request a copy of my BC because my old one had ripped and there was no hospital or doctor listed. Additionally can these “birthers” provide proof that the FBI, Secret Service, DNC, or State Department did not investigate President Obama’s citizenship? I have never seen a statement from any orginazation that says they did not investigate. Maybe I missed that.
Heavy, I invite you to visit this web site, and then reconsider whether only liberals play the race card.
http://www.pastorlindstedt.org/ml110408.html
It it, of course, very difficult for conservatives to play the race card, because what they would say would likely be considered taboo in our culture. Pastor Lindstedt is beyond concern for taboos.
Another one who misses the point. HE MUST PROVE HE IS ELLIGIBLE.
NOONE has established this.
Well, doc, I never thought I would see the day that you would stretch so far. Sad, really. A man of your intelligence sighting an example of the lunatic fringe.
But, hey, whatever works for you.
How about Rev. Wright, Farakahn (Sp?) and the like who have tutored your messiah? Oh, that’s right. I forgot. That dosen’t count.
Heavy, how do you know that no one has established this? If you can show us in this forum an official statement from the FBI, State Department, US Military, or Secret Service that states that they have not verified his origin or birth, then you would have a point that it has not been established. You keep forgetting that this is America. It is for you to prove that he is not. I would find it hard to believe that the US Military, FBI, and Secret Service would not have done a background check on the President long before he was able to view any sensitive information. He has a US passport and provided a document to the US State department which verified that he was a citizen in order to get one. Unless you can show us a document that he was naturalized, (so there would be record of a green card), had a passport issued from another country, or some document proof that he was from elsewhere, then the most logical conclusion would be that he was born where his official HI BC states he was. Like many have said before, if is not for him to prove he is,it is for those that think he is not to prove it. If you were accused of a crime, it would be for the accuser to prove that you were guilty, not for you to prove that you are innocent. Other than that I do respect your passion in wanting to see the “COLB”…
The simple truth is NO dept., person or agency is charged with qualifying a Presidential candidate. It certainly IS for him to prove.
How do we know he meets the age or residency requirements? Do we just take his word for it?
From time to time, and now again, I ask Heavy when any former president has proved his eligibility. If not before, then why now?
I don’t ever remember getting an answer.
Now the best I can figure out for Heavy to respond is to say that no doubts were raised before. But surely a requirement is a requirement, whether there are doubts or not. But even accepting the doubt reason, I would then respond, “but the doubts are all based on false information and errors of reason.” I would further respond that this web site is full of articles showing that the doubts are baseless. So if there are no reasonable doubts, then there’s no special reason to make a novel requirement of a president to prove his eligibility. Indeed, Obama is the first president I know of to publish a birth certificate. So Obama has done MORE to prove his eligibility than his predecessors.
So if it is a matter of doubts, then I would put it to Obama’s detractors to prove the basis of their doubts first. So far, they’ve had a sorry record.
Heavy asks: “How do we know he meets the age or residency requirements? Do we just take his word for it?”
No, we can take the word of his Indonesian school registration form, which is universally held to be authentic. It shows both age and place of birth. As for the 14 year residency requirement, the public record easily tracks Obama for the last 14 years.
It’s done by the Congress first week in Jan. But of course we all know Obama is really a fifteen year old Kenyan refugee.
to my knowledge, elligibility does does have to be proven unless challenged. I don’t know of any other candidate being challenged save the info here about ole Chet.
Your guy has been and will continue to be challenged. It will not stop. He will be forced to fess up.
Great “Detective” work, Gordo!
Another reach, Doc.
Actually… you are close, but no cigar.
The standard is not a “challenge.” The standard is actual evidence of ineligibility. An example might be, say, a Kenyan Birth Certificate, or an affidavit by someone asserting first hand knowledge of a Kenyan birth.
Sadly, “Internet rumor” does not exactly rise up to the standard.
To whom? You?
Who are you?
Would you agree that someone could come up with a challenge (like Obama was not a human being but an alien reptoid) that was so silly, so utterly without basis, that it would not require an answer?
All I’ve been saying here is that the current challenges raised against President Obama are so silly and so utterly without basis that they don’t require an answer.
Nah, I was just playin’ wi’cha.
I’m just pulling your chain Heavy. While you remain on the dock, this ship has sailed. You’ll be wailing about this thing years from now, like one of those Area 51 Goomers.
As a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, then Senator Obama had to go through the most rigorous background and security clearance imaginable, because he was privy to highly sensitive intelligence reports.
Oh Vei Doc, you should put a warning sticker on that puppy. I went to that site and need a sanitizing bath. Of course much of the birther movement is cloaking this vile racism, which frankly the Republicans have allowed to permeate their party.
The Obama camp knew, immediately, that the whole birth certificate issue was bogus. It was a valid document, showing that Obama was born in the United States and a citizen thereof, and had nothing like a different name or declaration of religion or anything else. But someone in the Obama camp heeded Napoleon’s legendary counsel to “never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake,” and let the nuts run with the story for weeks, knowing that all the energy poured into this red herring would be energy that would not be funneled into other, more potentially fruitful, alleys.
A theory that continues to this day. If enough birthers and other unreasonable haters continue expending energy of these useless endeavors, the more they shine a light on themselves. Reasonable people will be turned off by the madness and at least give the new administration a fair chance to govern.
Pretty much, Heavy is the Great Decider the Redux.
Definition of mental obsession: Participating in a discussion about Orly Taitz’s irresponsible remarks counseling against vaccination for the novel flu strain A/H1N1 by posting a comment “The simple truth is NO dept., person or agency is charged with qualifying a Presidential candidate. It certainly IS for him to prove.”
Heavy, it’s a bit chilly today in New England. Any comments?
Wow, Orly’s latest post calling for an armed militia to take back America. Isn’t that sedition? Not going back to that site.
It is like what was said earlier…We don’t have a clue if President Obama has proven his eligibility. However since he has a US Passport, was a US Senator and had access to classified material, I would have to believet that someone has verified his information. Everytime we hear that he needs to show his COLB, I ask to whom? Is he supposed to release it to the general public? I would like to know of another President that released his birth certificate while he was the sitting President. Probably not. All of the “birthers” think they are some sort of judge and jury and can demand these documents because of some innuendo and rumor. That is ridiculous. There may not be any government branch responsible for verifiying this information, but there doesn’t have to be. For 43 other Presidents there has been no issue so why is there one now? I think we all know the reason but it also shows the “birthers” to be a bunch of misguided individuals. If you notice every one of those “birther” sites are asking for a “donation” or selling something. While on site like Dr C’s all he has done is exposed the ridiculous statements by true foriegners like Orly to be false by providing something the “Birhers” have not been able to provide, evidence.
You forgot RACIST!
So Heavy, you don’t believe any of the furor and all of the anti-Obama sentiment has anything to do with race? Did you look at any of the “tea bag” rally photos? Have you read any of the Orly or Grand Jury websites? Have you seen that sites like stormfront are aligning themselves with this so called “Movement”? I try not to use the race card but sometimes if it quacks like a duck it is a duck. I am not calling you a racist. I seriously think you believe that our rightfully elected President of the United States is somehow not eligible. However for some it is not about that. You can bury your head in the sand and not believe it. But anyone with their eyes wide open can see it.
I was surprised to see that Orly visited the Centers for Disease Control during her recent trip to Atlanta, and presented her conspiracy theories about public health to a department spokesperson, Mr. Daigle.
Remarkly, in Orly’s account of the conversation, significant amounts of good public health information survived among the parts about the rumors she was touting.
http://www.orlytaitzesq.com/blog1/?p=765
While the decision has not been announced, the information I’m getting is that there will be a mass H1N1 vaccination program next fall.
As of today (May 21, 2009) there had been over 5,000 confirmed cases of the H1N1 Swine Flu in the United States and 9 deaths.
Remember, people who do not get vaccinated run the risk of getting the flu and killing other people that they spread it to.