Stanley Ann Dunham
The utter lack of disrespect that some birthers show towards the president’s deceased mother appalls me, particularly the frequent claims that she is a “liar”. I was raised not to disrespect anyone’s mother, and particularly not a departed one, and I was taught not to call anyone a liar unless I was pretty damned sure it was true. What compounds the insult is that there is no evidence whatever to support the nasty speculation.
The New York Times article earlier this month, carried comments from Congressman Neil Abercrombie.
… Mr. Abercrombie, who has represented Hawaii for nearly two decades in Congress, was a close friend of Mr. Obama’s parents, who were students at the University of Hawaii in 1961. The president’s father, Barack H. Obama Sr., was from Kenya, but Mr. Abercrombie said the suggestion that the Obama baby was born in Africa is an absurd impossibility.
“He was born in Kapiolani Hospital, right down the street from where I lived,” Mr. Abercrombie said. “They had no money. I can’t imagine how they would get to Kenya. It makes no sense at all. It’s an insult to his mother.”
I agree.
doc said:
unless you’re snarking, which i suspect you’re not, i think you meant:
if there’s one thing the birfers have shown no lack of, it’s disrespect for barack’s mother.
Really irritates me too. Even when I despised Bush’s policies, I didn’t call Barbara Bush a ‘dame’. These people have no shame. By the way- they aren’t any better about his Hawaiian grandmother either.
However, his Kenyan Grandmother(who is not the actual birth Grandmother) is a saintly paragon of truth- at least when they believe the story they want to believe.
Helll, being the traitors that they are, the birthers’ disrespect for the mother and grandmother of The President of The United States is hardly surprising, look at the nastiness directed at President Obama’s wife and children, THAT shows the lack of class that makes up the birther cult.
With the exception of the lawsuit that claims Sarah Obama is a witch.
I wish I could be surprised, but I remember when Rush Limbaugh put up a picture of Chelsea Clinton, then 13 years old, and called her the “White House Dog”.
I regret to say that back around that time, I considered myself a conservative, but I abandoned it in part because of the demagoguery of people like Limbaugh and Gingrich and the growth of “movement conservatism”.
In my experience small offenses like treason often lead to bigger ones such as being disrespectful to one’s mother.
C’est la vie.
I’ve heard this kind woman dragged though so much muck. It sickens me.
What really shows the Birthers true colors is the supposed nude photo of Obama’s Mom.
(It was traced back to a free vintage porn site.)
The holy roller right wingers sure seem well-versed on sources for free porn, don’t they.
Standards of respect apply, Lupin. It is one of the ways I can tell a mature adult from a teenage adult. I thought that the conservative movement was about respect for the individual. Apparently that applies only to those who agree with them.
Not even his mother, I’ve seen comments in YT like this one:
“It is a coincidence that Obama’s grandmother died the day before Obama was elected exactly when he went to visit her”
Cruel comment, unbelievable!
The birthers are complete clowns with an astounding level of arrogant ignorance.
The silver lining is the DISrespect the birthers get from judges across the Unites States. Not one judge has failed to kick their asses out of his or her court room. They have a 100% failure rate.
I laugh every time they come to a court date and are soooooo sure they will get a hearing only to be followed by the crash-and-burn.
Then they vow to appeal the decision.
Look back at their postings in Dec 08 when they were sure that Justice Thomas was taking this seriously – NOT.
DCA:
You seem totally unaware of the fact that Obama’s mother perjured herself under oath in the Obama/Dunham “divorce” proceeding. Of course you’ll never find that out since you and your kind will go to any length to Enable an ineligible man in the Presidency so defending his mother from lying (which she clearly did) is right down your alley.
Still making unsupported assertions I notice? And even if she ‘perjured’ herself in a divorce proceeding, what relevance has this to the fact that President Obama was duly elected and qualified.
Shame on you my friend. But then again, this may be ‘par for the course’?
Stanley Ann Dunham committed the egregious sin of having a child by an African man. In some quarters that negates any respect one would normally garner. There were some Right Wing sites that posted nude pics of a women and claimed it was Stanley Ann. Conservative journalist Lisa Schiffren wrote in the National Review that Obama was a “Secret Communist Baby”. She said that both Barack Sr. and Stanley Ann were Communist, because during the 50’s and 60’s that was the only way white females dated black men. She also said if abortion had been legal in all likelihood Stanley Ann would have had one. Ugly stuff.
http://workbench.cadenhead.org/news/3321/lisa-schiffren-obamas-secret-commie-baby
W T F are you talking about? jtx, you’re losing it. Either put up, or shut up. I gather you don’t post links to your nonsense because they are Freepers specials and you know that doesn’t fly here. And at the end of the day whatever happened in her divorce is not relevant to the vitriol she has been dished.
What a stupid statement by Lisa Schiffren. She is either not old enough to remember or she ignores the reality that just because abortion wasn’t legal, safe and available, that abortions didn’t happen all the time before 1972 and Rowe v Wade. Safe abortions by a doctor were always available with women with money who would go to a high priced gynecologist who performed abortions in his office in the States, or tofly to Mexico or France. And for those without money, there was Molly O’Ryan, or Mammy Kate in the tenement house who would do the deed with her knitting needle or coat hanger. No matter what your point of view on this issue, if you don’t realize that being legal doesn’t stop or cause abortions. A woman who doesn’t want a baby will find a way to not have it. If Ann Dunham didn’t want her baby, she wouldn’t have had him, no matter how legal abortion was. Tell me people aren’t this naive.
It’s not surprising for some people who’s dislike of Obama is racially motivated.
To them, Stanley Ann Dunham is a “race traitor” who committed the unforgivable sin of having a child by a black man, (and later a brown asian man)
In 1930, my mother was 18. A neighbor went to bed with her boyfriend, and became pregnant. When she told her father, he called her a tramp, locked her out of the house, and disowned her. She came to my mother begging for help. My grandfather bootlegged, so my mother got $100 together, and the neighbor had an abortion in NYC. She was butchered. My mother said she was not going to tell me who, because she belonged to our synagogue.
In 1989, I was working in DC. A friend of the manager came in with her baby, whose father was black. One co-worker looked at the baby and said “Where did that one come from?”
Sure, Ann Dunham had a black boyfriend, so of course she was a commie – who else would do something so despicable?
America is changing, and the denialists are going clinically mad.
Wait, she’s not?
“Apparently that applies only to those who agree with them.”
And when did you realize this?
Yeah, what a coincidence.
“Perjured under oath?” In what way??
Actually, I thought it was a claim that Grandma Robinson (Michelle’s mother) was a witch who practiced voodoo in the White House.
It’s particularly tragic given the fact that she was such a remarkable woman for any era, let alone the 1960s and 70s.
She was a PhD Anthropologist who worked among the poor craftspeople of Indonesia, a recognized expert in native textiles, and an innovator in the field of microfinance… later in life consulting for the largest microfinance programs in the world.
She was accomplished and admirable of her own accord, even had she never given birth to the current leader of the free world.
Of course, jtx lobs his grenade, and then…… Crickets. I still want proof Sarah Palin wasn’t born in Canada, and proof that she, not her daughter, gave birth to Trig. That child deserves to know who his real mother is.
Gordon & Patrick McKinnion:
Read her divorce papers from O. Sr. and then track the fact that she was living in the WA area during quite a bit of the 2 years she swore in the divorce that she had lived in HI … she was actually in WA attending the U of W.
The truth is there on the Web – dig it out.
Adrianinflorida:
Sort of like American citizens need to know the truth about O’s eligibility, eh??
As for any “grenade” – it’s not a grenade at all but is easily available on the Web if one merely looks.
nbc:
Sorry, Enabler, but it’s supported indeed as I told others just above – go look and find the data yourself.
Like mamma, like son I guess.
Gordon:
Yes, Gordo, the truth sometimes what you’d like it to be. Mamma O. Jr. clearly WAS a communist – and if fact so was her son if you but look at his political record in IL.
Why do you think that Stanley Ann always stayed away from America as a place of residence as she obtained her education and moved to Indonesia?? Why did she not return to the US but remained an expat??? She hated America and passed that notion on to Barry and it shows today in many of his actions but you Flying Monkeys seem unable to observe that because you wish to believe otherwise.
Patrick McKinnion:
Ah, yes, the anonymous “some people” with the intent to smear anyone who disagrees with you.
Here’s one guy who cares not a whit whether O Jr’s parents (either and/or both of them) were white, black, blue, green or purple nor does that enter into whether or not the man is eligible for the office he now holds – but you’re too mind-clouded to realize that.
Are you as confused as Donofrio about domicile and residence?
HistorianDude:
And she got lots of funding from the Ford Foundation to do a good bit of that.
It may very well be that the “current leader of the free world” will not be such once it is shown that he cannot prove his eligibility to hold that office any longer.
This is civil procedure 101. Residence is a legal term with a legal meaning. For example, here’s what the Hawaiian statute says:
(5) A person does not gain or lose a residence solely by reason of the person’s presence or absence while employed in the service of the United States or of this State, or while a student of an institution of learning, or while kept in an institution or asylum, or while confined in a prison;
Students outside the state still reside inside the state.
Do you guys know that the law has specialized terms that aren’t the same as in common, everyday speech?
Do you guys EVER get tired of being insanely wrong?
HistorianDude, don’t answer the idiot, it’s a waste of time. He’s a classic troll.
This will go over the idiot judge’s head.
It’s true: Grandma Robinson sells voodoo dolls on eBay; I bought one. In fact, with that doll, I conjured a ghost.
More smears from JTX- he really doesn’t have any shame does he? Wait until he gets started on Obama’s kids. I cringe to think up what he will make up about them.
“And she got lots of funding from the Ford Foundation to do a good bit of that.”
And that is a bad thing how? This is the organization that funded Sesame Street amongst other things. Unless of course you are into Bircher accusations.
“Yes, Gordo, the truth sometimes what you’d like it to be. Mamma O. Jr. clearly WAS a communist”
a) prove it- and b) last I heard it was legal to be a communist in the U.S.. Of course this is the usual smear tactics of the right- smear the target with wild unsubstantiated rumors of being a pinko- McCarthy would be proud of you.
“Why do you think that Stanley Ann always stayed away from America as a place of residence as she obtained her education and moved to Indonesia”
Maybe because she had a doctorate in Anthropology and wanted to put it to work? Maybe because she lived in Indonesia and found the country fascinating? I have known corporate people who have worked most of their careers over seas, yet you wouldn’t call them haters of the United States? Anyway- as usual JTX- full of puff, but no evidence that his mother hated the United States OR that Obama hates the United States. I do suspect however that you hate the United States. And to put it in JTX terms- Your hatred of America is shown in your actions.
Oh and JTX- good smearing of a dead woman by saying she perjured under oath. I notice Birthers like to attack the dead- less concern about lible or slander. McCarthy would indeed be proud- as would Lenin actually.
It should not come as much of a surprise that JTX is once again unfamiliar with the facts: namely that students maintain their ‘residence’ in Hawaii even while studying out of state.
The truth is out there, too bad JTX seems to be unable to follow his own advice and “dig it out”.
Hilarious
Sadly enough, JTX’s own words contradict, once again his claims.
Microfinance? Isn’t that capitalism?
Really amazing, my BA was from Univ of Hawaii, I attended graduate school at USC, while there I was listed as resident of Hawaii. Wow, I am a perjurer, who do I turn myself in to. Either I am a perjurer or jtx is an idiot, which one is it? (Correct answer – jtx is an Idiot)
In fact, looking at her anthropolical work, it looks like she was a capitalist. She wrote that government anti-poverty programs that ignore the capitalist realities were destined to fail.
Her proposed solution to poverty was a classically capitalistic solution, micro-credit.
Words, like “communism” have meaning, jtx, and you are making a hash of the English language by calling this woman a communist.
We do know the truth about The President’s citizenship, there’s no question amongst anyone with any common sense. President Obama is a natural born American citizen.
She was a communist? Then why did she spend most of her life promoting capitalism?
Weird.
Awesome. The Ford Foundation. Big bucks from a big American capitalist company!!!!
When I went to graduate school, I tried to apply for a local drivers license in the town where the university was. I was refused because they said I wasn’t a resident (even though I was going be working for the university as a teaching assistant and I had left my parent’s home permanently).
So I suppose everybody will be joing in the national general strike this Friday?
http://216.221.102.26/blogger/post/Calling-A-National-General-Strike.aspx
I don’t know about Mrs. Robinson, but definitely mama Sarah:
http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2009/07/birthers-on-a-witch-hunt/
Hey, thanks for the tip. My cat and I have enough food for a week, so we’re good to go. Now if I could only teach him how to hold a protest sign…
Yes, it is a building block of a free market. Even the kibbutzim are transitioning to a market economy. Realities of the 21st century, and all that.
Adrianinflorida wrote:
Helll, being the traitors that they are, the birthers’ disrespect for the mother and grandmother of The President of The United States is hardly surprising, look at the nastiness directed at President Obama’s wife and children, THAT shows the lack of class that makes up the birther cult.
***********************
I confess that I did snicker over the photos of the Bush twins crawling about the barroom floor, three-sheets-to-the-wind.
nbc,
It’s hilarious that JTX, who claims to be a judge but who will never cite judicial precedent to support his views, doesn’t know the difference between “living” in Hawaii and having residency in Hawaii. Obama’s mother didn’t claim that she had “lived” in Hawaii for the two years prior to the divorce filing. The divorce papers say that she “is now and for more than two years past has been a resident of Honolulu, City and County of Honolulu, State of Hawaii…”
I spent only four months in New York State during the years 1967-1970 but I never lost my status as a New York resident.
Occasionally students claim residency while attending an out of state school to get the cheaper tuition rate, had she claimed WA residency, that would have been perjury. She complied with the legal requirements for her tuition rate. For an idiot like jtx , this is beyond his comprehension. But, as his posts show, he is a bit retarded.
Yeah, I’m joining especially because reason number 6 on the list at that blog is “Chemtrails”. Birthers’ have thrown their Lot in with the chemtrail nuts. Game. Set. Match.
Chemtrails, you say? I like your ideas sir. How may I subscribe to your newsletter?
Oh sweet Jesus. Go over here, and scroll down to the bottom of two (very long) posts.
They’re calling for DNA tests now:
http://citizensagainstproobamamediabias.wordpress.com/2009/08/25/birthers-by-definition-cannot-be-called-conspiracists/#comments
And race has nothing to do with it…ho, ho, ho:
“U.S. Rep. Lynn Jenkins offered encouragement to conservatives at a town hall forum that the Republican Party would embrace a “great white hope” capable of thwarting the political agenda…of President Barack Obama.”
This is the gift that keeps on giving. Ah, it doesn’t get any better.
http://cjonline.com/news/state/2009-08-26/jenkins_remark_raises_eyebrows
I love how when confronted with physical evidence, the COLB, they simply repeat “Lie, Lie,Lie” like any other brainwashed cultist. That’s a hillarious blog.
Ms Jenkins email is disabled. Imagine that.
She should resign. Trolls, don’t even come here and try to say “great white hope” is not a racist term. It was coined when Jack Johnson won the world heavyweight title. Whites were so appalled by films of Johnson pummeling white fighters, they called for a white who could beat him. They also hated his relationships with white women. Imagine that. Jenkins is a racist. It just finally slipped out. She should resign.
I spent four years at West Point (New York) followed by 8 months in Oklahoma and a year in the Republic of Turkey… and was a resident of California the entire time.
Was jtx absent the day they discussed perjury in judge school?
You’re right… it wasn’t a grenade. as it turned out, it wasn’t even a water balloon.
jtx, I live in Obama’s state senate district. Trust me, Obama is no Communist, which by the way is not against the law. But your earlier comment about his mom committing perjury is troubling on so many levels. Your desperation to paint all things Obama in a negative light has really fvcked your chit up. Best you let this BC madness go, and concentrate on life. Obama’s going to be President another 3 plus years.
And it was also used for Max Schmeling, when he beat Joe Louis.
“In 1936, the situation in Germany had changed. Schmeling traveled to New York to face…Joe Louis…He surprised the boxing world by handing Louis his first defeat, dropping him in round four and knocking him out in the 12th. Schmeling returned to Germany on the Hindenburg as a hero.
The German Minister of Propaganda, Joseph Goebbels proclaimed Schmeling’s victory a triumph for Germany and Nazism. The SS weekly journal Das Schwarze Korps, commented: “Schmeling’s victory was not only sport. It was a question of prestige for our race.”
I forgot the attribution: it’s from Wikipedia. If anyone doubts me, google it.
So? It’s not unusual for students attending an out of state college or university to maintain legal residence in the state they came from.
If she kept her voter registration, drivers license, or even mailing address in Hawaii, then she remained a legal resident of the State of Hawaii.
I said “some people” Not everyone who dislikes Obama does it for racial reasons. Which is why I phrased it exactly like I did.
richCares:
Check out the facts before you mouth off Mr. USC Grad School nitwit.
Mamma Obamma was living in the state of WA from about August ’61 through about Sep ’62 – unless the U of WA is conspiring to defeat you Enablers … yeah; that must be it in spite of public records showing otherwise.
Check also her proclaiming that she had been “for more than two years past a resident of Hawaii” – the date on the document was Jan 20, ’64. That means she was lying unless your Enabler Conspiracy kicks in.
sure!
Greg:
You are full of beans about residency. Here’s more information about the HI requirements:
Other legal factors in making a residency determination include:
“1.The 12 months of continuous residence in Hawaii shall begin on the date upon which the first overt action (see evidences) is taken to make Hawaii the permanent residence. Residence will be lost if it is interrupted during the 12 months immediately preceding the first day of instruction.
2.Residency in Hawaii and another place cannot be held simultaneously.
3.Presence in Hawaii primarily to attend an institution of higher learning does not create resident status. A nonresident student enrolled for 6 credits or more during any term within the 12 month period is presumed to be in Hawaii to attend college. Such periods of enrollment cannot be applied toward the physical presence requirement.
4.The residency of unmarried students who are minors follows that of the parents or legal guardian. Marriage emancipates a minor.
5.Resident status, once acquired, will be lost by future voluntary action of the resident inconsistent with such status. However, Hawaii residency will not be lost solely because of absence from the State while a member of the United States Armed Forces, while engaged in navigation, or while a student an any institution of learning, provided that Hawaii is claimed and maintained as the person’s legal residence.”
As I said, she perjured herself in the divorce proceeding dufus. Seems being scofflaws runs in the Obama blood.
nbc:
Indeed you ARE hilarious in your mindless defense of the indefensible. According the the HI residency requirements (posted to Greg just above), she committed perjury as I said.
Your fanciful desire to misstate the state’s requirements are merely more of the Enabler Conspiracy idiocy.
You’re wrong!!
Check out the Hawaii statute I gave you. A student does not lose their residence in Hawaii because they studied in another state.
“Residence” and “resident” are legal terms that do not mean the same thing to the law as they do in casual conversation.
If you’re going to accuse someone of perjury, a legal term, you should have a passing understanding of the law!
Rickey:
Check it out yourself, [expletive deleted, Doc C.]. I posted the HI residency requirements and they clearly show she perjured herself.
The word “resident” means (hmmm!!) “resident” – but I thought you knew that. She committed perjury but like momma like sonny since he’s done that also and expects simpletons like you to sxtand up for him (and even his momma).
You Flying Monkeys are incredibly stoopid, but I guess that’s why God gave you wings rather than minds – to compensate.
You’re right that one cannot have two residences at the same time. HOWEVER living somewhere and being a resident there are not the same thing!
Look, for example, you drooling nitwit, at number 3 on that list you posted. Hawaii thinks you can live there without being a resident. That is the law everywhere.
Ann lived in Washington without losing her residence in Hawaii!
If you’re going to toss around legal terms like “perjury” you should have a passing familiarity with the law.
Patrick McKinnion:
Sorry, but you mindless [expletive deleted, Doc C.] have not read the residency requirements of HI it seems and are merely claiming what you like the law to be … how liberal lefty of you.
Your hero the Big O (or Big Zero) does the same thing – and frequently. Lying among libs is as natural as breathing.
Here’s another idea, JTX, read what you copy and paste.
Number 5 on the list you posted:
I mean, how retarded do you have to be to copy and paste something, take the time to bold one part of the information copied, and forget to read the rest of what you posted!
AdrianInFlorida:
Really??? By what flight of fancy did you determine that??? No one has ever been able to show that – not even the Oborter hisself!
Hey, jtx, YOU posted it, why don’t YOU read it!
Residency will not be lost if you live in another state while getting an education!
How do you tie your shoes?
Here’s what YOU quoted:
Those are the dangers, jtx, of cutting and pasting without reading.
What YOU posted makes clear that a student in another state doesn’t lose their residency.
Do you, in fact, know how to read?
jtx, now that you’ve posted the residency requirements which clearly state that living out of state while pursuing an education won’t sacrifice your residency status, I have some questions for you:
1. Do you think a quarterback is a refund?
2. Do you send faxes with stamps on them?
3. Do you try to put your M&M’s in alphabetical order?
4. Did you think Boyz II Men was a day care center?
5. Did you think Eartha Kitt was a set of garden tools?
6. Did you think General Motors was in the Army?
7. Did you think Meow Mix was a CD for cats?
8. Did you think TuPac Shakur was a Jewish holiday?
9. Have you tried to drown a fish?
Don’t feed the troll.
it’s beyond his level of intelligence, let him continue to make a fool of himself, he does that quite well. though he claims to be a judge he proves he is an idiot.
Donofrio’s latest gem: Was Obama’s Mother a US Citizen At The Time of Obama’s Birth?
How do we know Stanley Ann Obama didn’t avail herself – after she was married, but before Obama Jr. was born – of the BNA 1948 by registering to be a UKC citizen?
[…]
It’s more logical to assume Stanley Ann Obama did avail herself of UKC citizenship rather than assuming she did not.”
Whhhaaaaaa? It is more logical to assume that Obama’s mother renounced her U.S. citizenship that it is to assume she did not?
When called on this rampant, fact-free speculation, Donofrio responds: “Besides the fact that it’s entirely plausible that a woman such as Stanley Ann might want to lose her US citizenship in the 60’s, and despite the fact that it would have been natural for her to obtain citizenship in the same nation as her husband – despite all of this rational thinking which you characterize as ‘almost over the edge’… the point of the article was made crystal clear – as to Obama, we just don’t who the hell he is. Hard to believe we can sit here and legitimately ask these questions and we are not allowed to know the answers to them.”
While it is plausible, it is not probable, especially in the light no supporting evidence. Considering the relatively brief relationship Obama’s parents had (soon after Obama was born, they never lived together, and were divorced just a few years later), the window for it be “rational” for her to decide to give up American citizenship for CUKC status was pretty small. (Really, wouldn’t it have been much, much more rational for Obama, Sr. to become a U.S. citizen?) And this absence of evidence does not mean we don’t know anything about Obama, or that “someone” is preventing people from learning something that is even remotely relevant or grounded in a factual basis.
The stupid, it hurts.
And the obvious kicker: Even if both of Obama’s parents had CUKC status, if Obama was born in Hawaii, he’d still be a natural-born citizen!
He also makes the fact-averse statement that underpins most of the hopes of the people who hang their hat on the narrow view that Wong Kim Ark only applies to those who are permanent domiciliaries of the US.
“We know for a fact that Obama’s father was a UKC citizen and never became a US citizen and was never permanently domiciled in the US.”
We know the first two things, but the last is a mystery practically unknowable at this late date. It cannot be divined from the fact that Obama left the country – domicile requires an inquiry into the intentions someone has at the instant in question. If you want to establish jurisdiction in a personal injury case, for example, you look at the person’s intentions at the time of the injury.
Did Obama Sr. intend to stay permanently in the United States when Barack was born? Who the F knows? Donofrio certainly cannot know it “for a fact.”
This is civil procedure 101. No wonder Leo quit the law for poker! (His winnings from poker tournaments are listed as around $45k for three years, how bad does your law practice have to be for it to make sense to quit to make $15k a year?)
Irrelevant as the question is, we’ll have passport records for Stanley Ann soon enough to remove the microgram of plausibility on this theory.
Really? Why?
Oh no, you don’t. Orly, Donofrio and Puzy all say that a president must have two citizen parents – so don’t start on that liberal interpretation. You’re not fooling me.
Those three lawyers are the best constitutional minds in the country. In fact, Orly Taitz should be Chief Justice, since she knows more about Obama’s status than that liberal lackey Roberts.
Any day now it’s going to come out that Obama’s parents were commies, and he was a red diaper baby, just like Lani Guinier – whose mother was a Jew who schupted black men.
Gotta go – Donofrio is giving me lessons on winning at Texas Hold ‘Em.
FOIA request.
I just had a post disappear, so if this shows up twice, that’s why.
Donofrio starts off today’s gem with a statement of what we “know” for a fact, including that Obama’s father “was never permanently domiciled in the US.”
Donofrio should stick to poker. This is one of the first things you learn in civil procedure. Domicile is a specialized term that is distinct from immigration status. It means a place of abode and an intention to stay there permanently. It’s a fact-based inquiry that looks at the mental state of the person at the instant in question. Did Obama Sr. have an intention to stay here permanently when his son was born? The fact that he did have a son, and got married are pieces of evidence that suggest he did.
There seems to be a good reason why Donofrio gave up the law for poker.
I’m going to pout. The site just ate two of my posts, which were wonderful analyses of Leo’s flawed first paragraph – where he states we know for a fact that Obama Sr. never was permanently domiciled in the US.
1. Does it even matter?
2. The site can sometimes be buggy. So I try to save my work (via copying) before submitting.
richCares:
Glad you’ve finally admitted how wrong you are.
Now – back to the eligibility issue of the man who has never whoen himself to be legally eligible to hold the office he now occupies …. why does your ilk keep trying to defend the breaking of the law???
Greg:
Your claim is merely BS.
I posted the requisite regs from the U of HI previously which you apparently missed – so I’ll repeat them:
“Other legal factors in making a residency determination include:
1.The 12 months of continuous residence in Hawaii shall begin on the date upon which the first overt action (see evidences) is taken to make Hawaii the permanent residence. Residence will be lost if it is interrupted during the 12 months immediately preceding the first day of instruction.
2.Residency in Hawaii and another place cannot be held simultaneously.
3.Presence in Hawaii primarily to attend an institution of higher learning does not create resident status. A nonresident student enrolled for 6 credits or more during any term within the 12 month period is presumed to be in Hawaii to attend college. Such periods of enrollment cannot be applied toward the physical presence requirement.
4.The residency of unmarried students who are minors follows that of the parents or legal guardian. Marriage emancipates a minor.
5.Resident status, once acquired, will be lost by future voluntary action of the resident inconsistent with such status. However, Hawaii residency will not be lost solely because of absence from the State while a member of the United States Armed Forces, while engaged in navigation, or while a student an any institution of learning, provided that Hawaii is claimed and maintained as the person’s legal residence.”
You may as well stop the lying and deceit – it won’t work to protect this guy (or his mamma). You don’t know what you’re talking about – obviously.
Adrianinflorida:
Just like Forrest Gump, you’re the living proof that “stupid is as stupid does”.
The COLB is not “physical proof” by any stretch of the imagination. It’s merely a fraudulent image posted on the Web by a squad of the Flying Monkey Brigade.
misha:
The Pubbies are as corrupt as the DemoCraps. Neither of them deserve the political power the have.
Bob:
Gee, roberto, perhaps you could you could provide Mr. D. with Mamma Obamms vital records to prove him wrong???
While you’re at it, how about grabbing Barry’s paperwork, too. Right out there available to the public, ain’t it???
while a student an any institution of learning, provided that Hawaii is claimed and maintained as the person’s legal residence
what does this mean?
“I posted the requisite regs from the U of HI previously which you apparently missed…”
Did you read them?
Re-read them. Carefully, slowly. Pay special attention to 3 and 5.
I’ll wait.
Copying and pasting residency requirements from the University of Hawaii: 5 seconds.
Failing to read them before posting them: 0 seconds.
Argument FAIL in 3, 2, 1
““We know for a fact that Obama’s father was a UKC citizen and never became a US citizen and was never permanently domiciled in the US.””
But do we really ‘know'(in Birther terms) that Obama Sr was a UKC citizen? Do we really know that he was never a U.S. Citizen? Until we see his UKC citizenship paperwork(long form original birth certificate, attested to by the attending midwife, and validated by extensive testing) he may have been born in the United States. How can we prove he was not born in the U.S.?
Has it been proven that he never became a U.S. Citizen?
I mean I really think all evidence leans towards him being born in Kenya but is there really sufficient proof?
jtx,
The word “resident” means (hmmm!!) “resident” – but I thought you knew that.
And you claim to be a judge? Do you have a copy of Black’s?
Legal Residence The place of domicile or permanent abode, as distinguished from temporary residence. Permanent fixed place of abode which person intends to be his residence and to which he intends to return despite temporary residences elsewhere or despite temporary absences. U.S. v. Calhoun, C.A.Fla., 566 F.2d 969, 973
The Dunhams moved to Hawaii from Washington in 1959, when Stanley Ann Dunham was 17. She married Barack Obama Sr. in February, 1961 and Obama was born in August, 1961. Obama’s mother enrolled at the University of Washington in January, 1962 ane Barack Sr. graduated the University of Hawaii in June, 1962.
Do the math. Stanley Ann Dunham resided in Hawaii for 18 months before she married Obama, Sr. and she continued to physically live in Hawaii until she enrolled at the University of Washington. As others have pointed out, attending school in Washington had no effect or her status as a legal resident of Hawaii, and nothing that she did between January 1962 and January 1964 did anything to change her status. She then enrolled at the University of Hawaii and graduated in 1967.
The only issue here is legal residency. Temporary residency has no effect upon legal residency. Maybe you need to go back to law school for a refresher.
This has become so ridiculous it borders on pathetic. Questioning whether or not the President’s mother renounced her US citizenship, you have to ask yourself when will it end. What else will the President have to produce in order to satisfy these idiots? I know that it is supposed to be funny but I wouldn’t be surprised to see Orly or her followers request the following…
http://www.theonion.com/content/news_briefs/afterbirthers_demand_to_see
“In the continuing controversy surrounding the president’s U.S. citizenship, a new fringe group informally known as “Afterbirthers” demanded Monday the authentication of Barack Obama’s placenta from his time inside his mother’s womb.”
Exactly. Good point. Something else: how do we know that BHO Sr. was not born on a steamship? No one has never denied it.
What did Orly Taitz do for a living in Moldova? It’s one of the poorest nations in the world. What she a streetwalker? Did she enjoy schupting goyim? How many partners did she have before she married?
Russian/Israeli: sounds promiscuous.
The Onion is my standard.
I can do it too: Obama Orders 300M Copies Of Birth Certificate.
Misha, that was funny…
Reminds me of my article from last December, Soros and all.
http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2008/12/obama-announces-national-natural-born-day/
Meanwhile, someone in another galaxy attempts to analyse Glenn Beck, and produces a stick with two wrongs ends…
http://216.221.102.26/blogger/post/Is-Glenn-Beck-for-real.aspx
I read it. Crazy, meet insane.
Every single foreign person i know who married a Nigerian in the 1960 till date retained there foreign citizenship but only acquired Nigerian citizenship making them dual national. ALL their children took up there foreign parent citizenship as well as their Nigerian citizenship & are making very good use of it as many now reside in those foreign countries . I know this because several of my cousins are in this situation & we grew up jealous of them not needing visas to go to those countries & able to settle there needing very little documentation as against someone going as an immigrant.
No African will ever encourage his(her) foreign partner to relinquish there citizenship status as it opens the door for that partner to take up such foreign citizenship easily.
It does not make sense this argument by Don !!!
Also how can the absence of a shred of evidence b proof of that evidence !!! How does Obama prove his mother didnt do what almost nobody does simply because they marry a foreigner ????
richCares:
Can’t read, eh??? The regs given just above your blather are from HI U re residency.
But the fact that his momma was a liar/perjurer (like momma, like sonny) matters not. The real issue is for sonny to prove that he is legally eligible to hold the office he now occupies.
I doubt that anyone will bother to revisit the bogus divorce proceeding to claim that momma was a bigamist when she “married” Lolo Soetoro – or do you think that should be done just to clear the air???
Still making this foolish argument? Even though people have shown you being unable to read?
President Obama’s eligibility has been decided when Congress certified the elections and found Obama to have qualified. Now, only one remedy exists, “impeachment”.
Good luck my friend.
misha:
Doubt it??? Not for a New Yawk minnit!!
But a serious question – when you see the Nazi propaganda machine in operation re this boxing match, doesn’t it trigger any recognition in the propaganda antics of your hero the Oborter???
Bob:
Your 4th grade American History lessons didn’t do you any good at all, did they.
You’re wrong about that, too. O has told everyone that he was not a NBC at birth but was governed by the BNA48. A lot of people are beginning to have this soak into their minds – eventually it will invade your psyche also (but it may take 50 – 60 years it looks like).
“Can’t read, eh?”
I didn’t realize you were illiterate.
But, from what you posted. What do you think this means:
“Hawaii residency will not be lost…”
We’ll take this step by step. “Judge.”
Greg:
Indeed O Sr WAS never a US resident. He was here as an alien using a student visa and he shortly returned to his homeland.
We stopped caring what British law said about people back in 1776. You really should have learned this in first grade.
Oh, and he didn’t say he wasn’t an NBC. He said he WAS an NBC and the totally irrelevant British law applied to him.
“[I]t is the inherent right of every independent nation to determine for itself, and according to its own constitution and laws, what classes of persons shall be entitled to its citizenship.”
Why do you disagree with that sentiment, jtx? Why should every nation in the world get to decide who its citizens are, except the poor United States, who has to first see what other nations think?
misha:
Like the proverbial room rull of monkeys (even Flying Monkeys) you DO sometimes utter some (unintentional no doubt) truths when you say:
“… it’s going to come out that Obama’s parents were commies …”
In fact, both were communists. It’s nice that you noticed, though, even though you don’t “have the slightest” about what that implies for our country (or care, I’d say).
“Judge,” you should remember from first year law school that “permanent domicile” is not the same alien status. You can be here on a student visa and still establish a permanent domicile.
Permanent domicile is determined by looking to see if there is an abode and a fixed intention to stay indefinitely. You can be permanently domiciled somewhere and be an alien. You can be permanently domiciled somewhere than later change your mind.
You have to look at O Sr’s intentions at the instant of Jr’s birth.
You haven’t done so. Getting married and having kids is often seen as a very good way of establishing that sort of intention.
Obama’s mom was such a terrible communist that she argued against government programs in favor of micro-capitalism.
Do you even speak English?
Not even close my dear friend. But you, invoking Nazis, have all but admitted defeat of your argument.
Well done my dear friend
Obama SR was a resident alien. But that does not matter, Obama himself was born on US soil and thus per Wong Kim Ark, a natural born citizen.
Simple
Even if this were the case, so what?
What does this imply for our country? Is this why you object to Obama being a duly elected president? Your ‘fears’ that he may be a communist?
So what…
I think it was Orly that played the Nazi card first. Folks don’t know much about Nazis. One of the early Nazi tactics was to disrupt town hall meetings.
“President Obama’s eligibility has been decided when Congress certified the elections and found Obama to have qualified. Now, only one remedy exists, “impeachment”.”
“Impeachment.” Isn’t that another common law term of art left undefined in the constitution? Not sure birthers will know what that means.
JTX- glad to see you are becoming more blatent in your lies…
“O has told everyone that he was not a NBC at birth”
No- he hasn’t. Actually he told everyone is a NBC- he did that when he filed his election papers.
JTX- you have no shame, no evidence, nothing but lies and wishful thinking
JTX- I keep calling you on it, but you slide past truths like a dime store lawyer-
a) Where is your proof that either parent was a communist and
b) Why does it matter? Other than trying to smear the parents and therefore taint the son by association- why does it matter? Its not illegal to be a communist in this country, its not as if being communist would disqualify President Obama, its not even as if they being communist would mean that the President was a communist(which again is legal, so this would just be a political point).
Why do you keep trying to use the tactics of McCarthy and Goebbels on the President? Have you no shame at all?
jtx the idiot can’t read:
his quote says:
“However, Hawaii residency will not be lost solely because of absence from the State while a member of the United States Armed Forces, while engaged in navigation, or while a student an any institution of learning, provided that Hawaii is claimed and maintained as the person’s legal residence.”
that contradicts his comments and the idiot doesn’t even know this.
Having LIVED in Hawaii, I dare say I know more about residency than you do for that state.
Here’s a hint – there’s a difference between “temporary residency” and “legal residency”.
To cite the very section you posted (bold face mine)
“3.Presence in Hawaii primarily to attend an institution of higher learning does not create resident status. A nonresident student enrolled for 6 credits or more during any term within the 12 month period is presumed to be in Hawaii to attend college. Such periods of enrollment cannot be applied toward the physical presence requirement.”
Which is about standard for most states. Non-resident students are presumed to be in that state as students, not as residence, and as such residency is not counted.
5.Resident status, once acquired, will be lost by future voluntary action of the resident inconsistent with such status. However, Hawaii residency will not be lost solely because of absence from the State while a member of the United States Armed Forces, while engaged in navigation, or while a student an any institution of learning, provided that Hawaii is claimed and maintained as the person’s legal residence.”
Pretty clear. If Hawaii is claimed as the student’s legal residence, then it doesn’t matter that the student is attending school on the mainland.
The irony being is that you yourself CITED this section, which goes against your earlier statements.
Oh, and I can express myself without profanity. You might give it a try sometime.
What I really like is that once a JTX statement is absolutely debunked he stops responding to that thread. Instead he pops up in another thread spouting the same stuff.
You guys keep saying jtx claims to be a judge. Are you serious? Doc, somebody has to repost.
Here is the original on this blog from June 27, jtx wrote:
Upon viewing jtx’s comment in context (it is a response to Cymraeg’s claim to be a lawyer with 40 years experience), I think it was actually a dismissal of the value of Cymraeg’s claim rather than a literal assertion by jtx that he was actually a judge, which the larger context of jtx’s body of work proves is not the case.
[As comments are added to this blog, the page numbers that are part of URLs may change.]
Can somebody tell me if Michelle Obama’s license was placed on “Court Ordered Inactive Status” in 1993?
It this true or another birther fantasy?
“Can somebody tell me if Michelle Obama’s license was placed on “Court Ordered Inactive Status” in 1993?”
I can’t see how this would be relevant in anything but a smear campaign?
In other words, at best, if true, its an attempt to smear the President for something his wife did, and at worst, its an outright lie intended to cause personal and political harm.
SJ Jeff you are right. These birthers can’t find anything against Obama so they are trying his family too. Sad!
It’s another birther fantasy. Her Illinois Registration status is “Voluntarily inactive and not authorized to practice law – Last Registered Year: 1993” Note VOLUNTARILY INACTIVE. In other words, she voluntarily ceased practicing law.
https://www.iardc.org/ldetail.asp?id=300982833
Can somebody tell me if Michelle Obama’s license was placed on “Court Ordered Inactive Status” in 1993?
Technically, yes.
The court order is required to avoid carrying malpractice insurance, but the decision not to practice law was her, not the court’s. She asked the court to go inactive, and they granted her request in the form of an order; hence the “voluntary” part. (If asked to go active again, and was eligible to do so, the court would allow her to do so.)
As explained in former Rule 770.
Barackryphal was on this back in January.
Amazing how the same lies get recycled.
Michelle went on voluntary inactive status in 1993 — at the time, the procedure in Illinois was to request that status from the court, thus “court-ordered.”
The reason for that status is that she took a job that did not require her to actively practice law. Being “inactive” relieves a lawyer from other obligations, such as payment of bar dues, meeting continuing education requirements, and/or maintaining malpractice insurance — but an “inactive” lawyer can reinstate their membership at any time simply by notifying the bar and meeting whatever requirements (such as payment of current bar dues) that are imposed on active lawyers.
That is a very old and long-discredited smear.
Yeah, and judges are not appointed straight out of law school. Even assuming jtx was elected justice-of-the-peace when he was 18, that would make jtx at least 75. Possible, but very, very unlikely.
IMO, jtx’s sarcasm was evident.
Yes doc I know this is old but the birthers don’t have anything else to do. All the fake birth certificates have been debunked they are all looking for something to start all over again the same old stuff.
Thanks to all!
Yes, that is what the birthers do. Recycling the same rumor.
My NYS optician license is inactive. I requested that, so I do not have to carry malpractice insurance, nor meet CE credits.
I can re-activate it at any time.
Birthers will stoop to anything. Only it’s not funny like She Stoops To Conquer.
Hey, no problem. If we didn’t recycle old material, there wouldn’t be anything to do but talk about Orly.
No evidence, no witnesses exist she was really his biological mother. Even the divorce decree of 1964 does not recognize child support since the Court did not know who the father was either. Funny how Barack Hussein Obama I never lived with Stanley Ann Durham Obama Soetoro isn’t it.
And no witnesses exist that can confirm the circumstances of John McCain’s birth. That must mean that John McCain lied about his birth place, since no witnesses exist. Do we even know who his father really was? I mean, no living witness can confirm it, therefore John McCain must have lied.
The public deserves the right to know.
Furthermore, no living witnesses can confirm that Ronald Reagan was really born where he said that he was born. Therefore, I propose that Ronald Reagan was really a communist plant from Russia, given fake birth certificates, and planted in the United States to destroy this country! This must be true, since no living person can confirm his birth circumstances.
Honestly, how many people do you think would actually remember his birth from 50 years ago, AJX?
Forget McCain, he is history. September 8, 2009 is next week and if Obama does not prove to an ex Marine Federal Judge in Santa Ana CA that he was really born in the USA he will be held in contempt of court and arrested for fraud. Simple as that. Hope his loan papers don’t come out. You know they are public documents with his SS# on them…
How do we know that Orly Taitz was not a streetwalker in Moldova?
When she declared she wanted to go to Israel, she was dismissed from her job. That’s a fact, not conjecture.
What else could she do for money?
Better hope Dr. Taitz is not sanctioned.
Are a betting man/woman as i sure as heaven will like to bet against u esp on what will happen on Sept 08 09 ?
What u say $100 ?
AXJ will lose.
Myson, my e-mail is in my profile. E-mail me.
“Funny how Barack Hussein Obama I never lived with Stanley Ann Durham Obama Soetoro isn’t it.”
How about from age 0 to 10?
“No evidence, no witnesses exist she was really his biological mother.”
By your standards only a DNA test would suffice- except unless of course if the mother had an identical twin. Really- where was this outrage over George Bush or Bill Clinton? Where was this suspicion that Barbara Bush was not Jr’s mom?
Nope- you birthers are only suspicious of the Black Man. Prior to our African American President, no one ever asked a President to prove his paternity or maternity. Now that isn’t proof that you are a racist, but then again since when do you folks rely upon proof? Lies, innuendo and gossip are your ammo.
Prove that his mother was not his biological mother. Prove that he wasn’t born on U.S. soil. You know- provide something beyond lewd gossip to prove your point.
“he will be held in contempt of court and arrested for fraud.”
September 8. Let us all reconvene here on that day to mock AXJ.
Sounds like AXJ is under the impression that there will be evidence presented to Judge Carter next week. Come back Sep 8 in the afternoon AXJ, and check in with us on how things went. My predictions:
– No evidence will be presented.
– No one will be proving anything about anyone.
– No one will be arrested for fraud or anything else.
– No one’s loan papers will come out.
– Ex-Marine Federal Judge and Birther Holy Priest will be nothing but a stinking Obot to you by 3 PM EST.
– See ya back here next Tues AXJ!
“No evidence, no witnesses exist she was really his biological mother”
Ridiculous, all one has to do is take one look at the picture of his maternal grandfather at this link. Look at it and try to tell us Ann Dunham is not his mother.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Armour_Dunham
If you overlaid a picture of Barack on young Stanley Armour Dunham, you’d have nearly an exact match.
Kimba, that grandfather was Caucasian so these folks would never think Obama could look like him. They have a funny idea about genetics.