I’ve added a new item to the Features menu: “Intro to birthers.” I realized that some people arrive to the story late and may not know what birthers are about, so I wrote a brief outline and history.
It will probably be enlarged in the future.
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But please no enlarged zibits, Doc. Dr. Orly has enough of them.
“and may not know what birthers are about,”
Our new community is heavily “conservative” with many far right wing and some pretty wacky Libertarians as well.
On a local forum yesterday, while discussing the Hobby Lobby case before SCOTUS, I asked one of the posters if he was also a birhter (cuz he was really ignorant on a lot of issues).
Not only he, but almost every other person on the form asked “what is a birther?” LOL
After giving a brief explanation, it was about 50/50 as to those who had heard of them and 100% coining them “conspiracy theory nuts”, “idiots”, and a couple of “are they still around? I thought that was over long ago.”
And this among a group of very politically-active people.
Yeah, birthers are a HUGE movement. But not the type of movement they think. 😉
Still , lots of name calling but not one of you has ever explained why Obama has a stolen social security number and a poorly forged birth certificate. When you can offer a non fairy tale explanation then we can move on to Obama’s own literary bio from 1981 when he himself claimed to have been born in Kenya. Funny you extreme lefties were so curious of the past of George Bush you counterfeited his military records but have not a bit of curiosity in the fraud that is Obama.
You haven’t explained why you think Obama has a stolen social-security number. Who did he steal it from?
I really doubt that anyone who comments here counterfeited George Bush’s military records. It’s a fallacy of generalization to blame a class of people for what one individual did.
Why do you think “Obama himself” made such a claim. The person who wrote the bio said the information wasn’t from Obama. Do you believe something contrary to all evidence out of some kind of need? Please explain.
Obama’s birth certificate isn’t forged. The State of Hawaii has verified its contents.
Sorry, but you are mistaken. The inability to read on your part doesn’t constitute a failure to explain on my part. See:
http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/?cat=2508
We should have perhaps realized when Birthers began their quests with idiotic premises and transparently false allegations, that the lunatic aspect of their activities was what they were talking about when they kept ignoring 100’s of legal losses and said, “THIS is NOT going away!”
Birthers are more of an unchanging social sediment born of extremism and racism, than a, “movement”; they are unmoving in almost every way that is necessary, to being a patriotic citizen, protecting the Constitution instead of walking all over it in an attempt to vent your hatred on a political opponent.
They are an off-shoot of right wing extremism, so off that they can’t get most of that crowd to join them in their lunacy and end up branding their own political cousins, “traitors”.
I do see them as the end product of a movement, but that would be a bowel movement.
Nothing but birther wet dreams.
Any credible evidence of the above allegations would be greatly appreciated. All credible evidence is to the contrary. Since birthers are the accusers, they bear the burden of proof. To date there is not even evidence, much less proof.
It is a fact Obama has a stolen Connecticut social security number. No way around that. It is a fact that his birth certificate is a fraud. Simple forensic examinations shows layered computer counterfeit. Hawaii has never authenticated the birth certificate Obama out. On Obama’s bio, where did literRy agent get information Obama was born in Kenya ? Did he just see he was black and guess Kenya ? The simple facts are there and you on the extreme left can not defend or make excuses to explain the fraud Obama, you have to use Alinsky rules to attack those who show clearly the lies .
Correct about the Connecticut SSN, but there is no evidence it was stolen and there is no evidence that the birth certificate is a fraud.
How come you cannot even defend your foolish ‘arguments’?
Sorry Seamus. As Judge Clay Land so aptly put it… This is not Alice in Wonderland. Saying it’s so does not make it so.”
That’s all birthers have done… Said so. They have produced not even a scintilla of evidence for those claims, much less proof nor established any facts of same.
You (and all birthers) have a gross misunderstanding of what evidence is, much less credible evidence. When you have something that meets the criteria of evidence, get back to us. Until then, thanks for playing.
And the above statement includes the drek thus far presented by Zullo.
If it is a fact, it should be no problem for you to document it.
No actual expert has said that.
The State of Hawaii has repeatedly and expressed said President Obama was born in Hawaii. It’s on the Hawaii Department of Health’s web site. The State of Hawaii sent verifications to two states’ Secretaries of State, who were satisified by the vertifcations.
Who knows; the main point is President Obama’s agent admitted to supplying the wrong information.
The propagandists of North Korea swear they witnessed Kim Jung Un get 18 holes in one the first time he golfed. That fairy tale is easier to believe then this Obama fraud you continue to push. The pure facts have Obama using a stolen social security number and a poorly fabricated birth certificate; both absolute facts. As an id and records specialist for The Ct . Dept. of Corrections with. 27 years experience; I actually train all other record specialists for the entire dept of corrections. It is the most often discussed case of identity fraud and assume it is all over the country. You will not find one law enforcement document examiner anywhere in our country to validate his documents. Not one, no where. This is the quietest great crime in the history of our country. Believe me , eventually the truth of this fraud will be revealed , it is far to obvious to prove he is a fraud . Why the media is not on this story is beyond my sense of truth and honor.
“Pure” “facts” that you can’t document.
On the Internet, nobody knows you are a dog.
“Any day now.”
And your intelligence: Because there is no there there.
My working hypothesis is that the phrase “pure fact” means an assertion which is “pure” in the sense than it transcends the mundane need to be backed up by evidence and reasoning.
There is no such thing as a Connecticut social secuirty number. SSN are centrally issued by the feds. Even when they did use a 3 digit geographic code, it was never written in stone that the number bore a 100% association with residence. Furthermore, if it is a fact it was stolen, you should have no trouble telling us from whom it was stolen. The “fact” is, birthers have no evidence that it was stolen. The “fact” is, if it was stolen, he wouldn’t have been able to file his tax return using it year, after year, after year….long before he was president, senator, state rep, or “community organizer”…you know…back when he had no power to prevent getting locked up for tax fraud.
You wouldn’t know a forensic examination if it bit you in the backside. Reality is the only real experts to have examined it have stated there is no evidence of tampering and examining a pdf is pretty much a waste of time, because you can’t prove jack with it.
Actually they have repeatedly. That, and they have also repeated confirmed all the facts on it (repeatedly), and filed certified documents with courts confirming those facts. Why would someone forge a document using the exact information that appears on the original? Just because you don’t like the facts doesn’t mean you can wish them away.
How should I know? Perhaps you should ask her. Entirely plausible she spoke with him, took bad notes, and connected father born in Kenya with him being born in Kenya. Who cares? There are several publications predating that bio stating he was born in Hawaii.
There is only one person who clearly lies here…you’ll find him the next time you look in the mirror. There’s a reason why no one takes birthers seriously….it’s because your “evidence” is a joke.
If any of Seamus’ silly charges were true, don’t you think that the Republicans who are in the majority in the House of Representatives would have held at least one congressional hearing on the President’s Social Security card or his birth certificate? Congress has not spent a single minute on any of those allegations.
If the 1991 Literary Agent’s bio for Barack Obama was not just an error, why do you think that the major newspapers in the U.S. Such as the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Chicago Tribune and the Los Angeles Times all ran stories about Barack Obama being elected Presiden of the Harvard Law Review in 1990, a year before the publisher’s bio, which all said that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii?
Don’t believe it? Here are links to the New ayork Times article from 1990 and the LA Times article from 1990. Read them and weep:
http://www.nytimes.com/1990/02/06/us/first-black-elected-to-head-harvard-s-law-review.html
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/thedailymirror/2008/09/barack-obama-ha.html
The Los Angeles Times’ March, 1990 article states: “His own upbringing is a blending of diverse cultures. BORN IN HAWAII where his parents met in college, Obama was named Barack, (“blessed” in Arabic) after his father. The elder Obama was among a generation of young Africans who came to the United States to study engineering, finance and medicine, skills that could be taken back home to build a new, strong Africa. In Hawaii, he married Obama’s mother, a white American from Wichita, KS.”
Well, no, he’s not really even correct about that. It’s a valid USA SSN. There is no such thing as a “Connecticut SSN.”
There is a bit of non-binding inconsequential bureaucratic trivia that the prefix of Obama’s original SSN was usually, but not always, assigned to people who first filed for their SSN from Connecticut.
How he or anyone else gets from there to it being stolen is a complete non-starter.
I don’t think you know the meaning of the word “fact”
Judging by the few statements you have made, I can feel pretty comfortable stating this is total b.s. Anyone who makes such postive statements based on a pdf, never having seen a physical document is nothing but a crackpot.
Sure it is. That’s why only Joe Arpiao and his sidekick Zullo talk about it. It’s “the most often discussed case” no one actually talks about in public. Sure. That makes sense.
Of course not. Because no one worth their salt will validate a pdf of a document. You only validate the real paper document. That’s a no brainer. Paper document is another thing. That is prima facie evidence of the facts stated on it, that will hold up in any court of law in the US>
Yes, becuase all you “forensic document examiners” and law enforcement folks generally stay all quite when you know the crime of the century is being committed. Yeah…I can see that as being plausible. A country full of people sworn to uphold the law all know a great fraud is being committed on the country, but the only person to speak up is a sherrif in Arizona with a history of going after his enemies with bogus criminal investigations, who just happened to be under investigation by the feds….and even he can’t get a real court qualified expert to give him a supporting opinion.
Any day now…..we’ve only been hearing that for 5 or 6 years now. But hey…keep hoping….any day now.
I don’t think you have any sense of truth and honor.
And the media isn’t on this story because they have a lot more sense than you. You have no evidence…in fact all the mountains of evidence … evidence that is actually admissible in court…points to the President being born in Hawaii. This isn’t a massive conspiracy of silence. You really have nothing to support your position. And even worse…not only is all your purported evidence of fraud bunk…you can’t even provide a single bit of court admissable evidence that the president was born anywhere but Hawaii.
This comment represents a type of unforced error that I rarely see outside of birtherstan–it is self-invalidating. One of the key figures in the incident you mention was a woman who went by the name Linda Starr–a nobody-who-wanted-to-be-a-somebody Democrat who later became one of the earliest and most deranged birthers. So, yeah, she concocted BS about Bush in 2004, and four years later, she concocted BS about Obama.
Wow! 27 years! That’s terrific.
But I wonder why, in all that time, you didn’t learn the correct name of your department?
According to its own website the name is Department of Correction……no “s”.
http://www.ct.gov/doc/site/default.asp
Maybe they changed the name and didn’t tell you…..is that it?
There are two document forensic professional standard associations that set the standard for All Law Enforcement ; N.A.D.E . And A.F.D.E. You will find that every member has run the Obama ducuments as pure curiosity and training. You will not ever find a member of these two organizations validate the birth certificate, selective service registration or his social security number . In fact this is the talk at every seminar and symposium . Eventually other professional document examiners will brave the political world and submitt independent findings thT fully support Mike Zullo. It is unanimous among forensic document examiners that Ovama is a fraud.
Nope, not a fact. My ex-wife has a Pennsylvana SSN (210-xx-xxxx) but she has never lived or worked in Pennsylvania. It happens.
If Obama’s SSN is stolen, who did he steal it from? And please feel free to provide whatever evidence you have.
The PDF has layers because it was saved as a PDF using a Xerox Workstation. The so-called anomalies in the PDF are not anomalies at all, once you know what office equipment was used.
No birther forensic document examiner has examined the original document which the White House used to make the PDF, and none of Zullo’s “experts” are qualified to give testimony in court about their bogus opinions.
Not only has it been authenticated to two state Secretaries of State, there is a link to it on the Hawaii Department of Health’s website.
http://health.hawaii.gov/vitalrecords/faq-obama/
First of all, the literary agent was a woman, which you would know if you bothered to use your supposed investigative skills. She never spoke to Obama, so she didn’t get the information from him. She probably was confused because Obama’s father, also named Barack Obama, was born in Kenya.
Alinsky? Who is Alinsky?
More “facts” … that you just make up.
“Talk” that only you hear.
“Any day now.”
So unanimous … that no member has publicly demonstrated their examination and results.
So nice of Seamus to drop by on the Intro to Birthers thread. He is a steaming, I mean shinging example.
If Seamus actually worked there, he was a clerical worker, a paper pusher. There’s nothing wrong with that, but it gives him no relevant experience to what we are discussing.
http://www.ct.gov/doc/cwp/view.asp?A=1496&Q=328982
No matter how improbable you find the life and accomplishments of Obama to be, the improbable is by definition more likely than the impossible, and therefore more believable.
I agree that Obama’s story is improbable. He overcame many disadvantages, from an absentee father to a funny name and everything in between. But guess what, chuckles? On a long enough timeline, with enough iterations, “improbable” events do occur (Especially in America!).
And double guess what? On a long enough timeline, “improbable” events will inevitably happen again.
And again.
And again!
Particularly in when the probabilities are shifting over time.
And triple guess what? Right now, the probabilities are shifting in favor of the next Obama. 😛
“. . . and submitt independent findings thT fully support Mike Zullo”
Some of these rage fueled birther bigots deserve to be swindled by a con artist.
Any day now, chuckleheads:
http://alturl.com/e4rvs
No supporting evidence is presented. Does it not bother you that I have shown that a Xerox workflow explains all the ‘evidence’ of ‘forgeries’?
Oops
Your turn.
Very true but people are sometimes a bit unfamiliar with how the SSN was assigned.
Their own unfamiliarity condemns them for jumping to a conclusion. Particularly a conclusion that they would prefer be true.
Poor birfers. Always finding that damn objectivity between them and their wantses.
Where are these talks documented?
JPotter, you will not find any trade group of forensic document examiners or any individual document examiner validate the Obama documents. Not one. That is not improbable , that is reality. The presentation by Mike Zullo on how these documents were forged is ample evidence and pure fact. These silly excuses of how Obama has a Connecticut s s I number or how his biographer guessed his country wrong or how he was listed as African American in 1961 , decades before the politically correct term was invented is very similar to the witnesses of Kim Jung Un ‘s 18 consecutive holes in one. I get it that you extreme leftist a that this is your religon, but you are in for a big let down when you find out your emperor has no clothes on . Kind of like when you find out thst there is no Santa .
And no examiner has found that you have a brain. Therefore, you must not.
Zullo is not an expert and has been caught in lies. And his “work” has been refuted here and other places.
The SSA has said that the first three digits do not always indicate the applicant’s state.
The agent (a woman) admitted it was her mistake.
Race is self-reported; ask Miki Booth.
“Any day now.”
Seamus… All hat and no cattle.
Zullo and his clown “posse”
Have not presented any evidence that leads to any fact of forgery. The only thing they’ve accomplished is to prove their incompetence. And that is a fact.
No forensic document examiner has ever examined Obama’s documents, qualified or not. No one has seen them who claims forgery.
Your idea of evidence and facts may be worse than Orly Taitz’s… And that says a lot. Though so are Zullo’s ideas of evidence and facts so it must be a birther thing.
And once again, otherwise you are no longer worth any time… please present your evidence. And that is not anything Corsi, Orly, Zullo or anyone else has presented because the “evidence” they present is incompetent and would never pass must’ve in any court. Well, except Manning’s fake trial or a similar one.
I’ll check back, though I know to date nothing exists except “birthers say so”.
From 1973 until 2011 all social security numbers were issued by the zip code of residence reflected in the first three numbers . Hawaii would be 575 or 576. No excuse or explation. In fact imput his number into the e-verify system and it gets rejected.
Wrong again. On both counts.
Plus you present no evidence of your claims… Again.
Amateur.
Boy, you are good at fairy tales, lol. You got nothing, zip, zilch, zero. Zullo is a nobody, a hack, a failure. President Obama is a 2 term President, and no amount of squeaking from a tiny mouse with an agenda will change that. Again, get back to us when you win a court case, ANY court case, princess.
More “facts” … without documentation.
You think that number is still being used? After birthers have spread it far and wide? Really?
Just a little over a year ago we were called racists for saying Bill Ayers ghost wrote Ibama’s books. You called us birthers and conspiracy nuts. Just recently Bill Ayers came out smugly and proud claiming he write the books . Yes Obsms is a fraud, a complete fraud. Not only was Ayers some guy that lived near each other, but what we were saying 5 years ago is fact. Just like these phony documents. Eventually we will win, truth is on our side.
I think it’s quite apt that we showcase Seamus here in this thread, as it is an introduction to birthers. Case in point, meet Seamus, obviously new to the scene, making claims long ago debunked here and on Fogbow, lol.
Still do, racist birther conspiracy nut. 🙂
The alleged fact that someone was unable to illegally access President Obama’s social-security number doesn’t mean that it’s invalid. It just means that the public can’t access it.
On the other hand, Obama has been using that social-security number on his income taxes with no problem, and the IRS checks that sort of thing.
The Connecticut series is nothing more than a curiosity. Any number of people have numbers that don’t fit the return address scheme, probably due to clerical errors.
Now here’s one for you. Law enforcement can verity social-security records (correct me if I am wrong on that). Has Arpaio reported that Obama’s SSN is bad? No.
You don’t have evidence of anything except your own amateurish approach to proof.
Speaking of reality……what “documents” have you or any “trade group of forensic document examiners or any individual document examiner” really examined involving President Obama?
Yes, it’s remarkably appropriate.
You do know what Sarcasm is, don’t you? You do realize that Bill Ayers was being sarcastic when he said that he wrote Obama’s memoirs. And the only reason he made the joke was because racist birthers and conspiracy nuts insisted that he did it. There is still no credible evidence that Bill Ayers ghost-wrote Obama’s book.
It is called sarcasm. S – A – R – C – A – S – M. You birther, racist conspiracy nut.
“Any day now.”
Your Bill Ayers claim is also a lie.
Got anything except bullshit and lies?
Didn’t think so.
I’ve been listening to this crap for over 5 years and to date there is not one scrap of credible evidence leading to any of the birther “facts”. I’m not going to start over at day one for someone who refuses to supply even a scrap of evidence.
Sorry. This is just boring BS. I suppose some here want to play with a new chew you.
Since he/she has refused to do anything except the usual birther “I say so”, I’m done. I don’t have the patience with birthers I used to have. Especially not a ignorant “newby”. Though I doubt he/she is new, just typically birther dishonest.
1. In order to enter Obama’s number into the E-Verify system, you have to be an employer of Obama, and Obama must have given you permission to do that by giving you employment documents such as a W-2. Mind showing me the W-2 that Obama gave you? What about your EIN? Mind telling me how much of Barack Obama’s salary you withheld in Social Security Tax for him?
2. If you’re talking about the Self-Check, you have to agree that you’re only using this system to check yourself. You then have to answer multiple questions verifying your identity as the person you’re running it on which specifically have the word “You” in them. Tell me, are you Barack Hussein Obama? And if not, then why are you illegally using the e-verify self-check in order to access his records?
Seamus is indeed handy to the topic as he is, based on his inability to spell or construct a decent sentence, a dunce. Too stupid to learn to write, and yet he’s come here to ‘wise us up.’ Oh, brother.
I remember Seamus’s brother, Wile E. Coyote. Endlessly entertaining.
The only negative connotation to the word “birther” was created by the people who bear the name. Conspiracy nut is however a pejorative.
Rather than re-invent the wheel, the electric light, the periodic table of the elements, penicillin and the transistor, I will refer you to the material already written:
http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/debunk
From that you will see that name calling is just what happens after birthers ignore the facts.
Great. , so now you acknowledge that Obama has a stolen Connecticut social security number. Like I said there is not a law enforcement records and forensic document expert in the country who has not run the Obama documents and there is not one who can validate the Obama documents. Not one. There are no national trade groups of document examiners that set the standard that can validate the Obama documents. Your smug arrogant name calling and blind adoration does not change the facts that support Obama as a complete fraud.
Troll.. in the dungeon.
As Jethro Tull would say, “Thick As A Brick”.
Kinda like he can’t hear over the soundtrack in his head.
Stolen from whom? Considering thatObama ha been filing his income tax with that number for three decades, I would think the SSA or the IRS would have said something about it by now. Especially when he started filing upper income tax returns from the sale of his books. Why have no alarm bells rung?
Of course not. Not one has had access to them and Obama has been placed under no obligation to submit them to an examiner.
With out access to them, how could they? They certainly would not do so with just a PDF and more than two hundred of them have explained that to Zullo who still seems to think that he can invalidate a document based on a PDF file.
1) The Merriam Webster dictionary dates “African-American” to 1855.
2) “African American” isn’t anywhere on Obama’s birth certificate.
3) Obama’s race isn’t on his birth certificate.
You’re doing wonders for your credibility.
It’s interesting how a birther shows up and the regulars go wild debunking him/her. It’s like the regulars have been going through debunking withdrawal and are getting a fix. 😆
No competent document expert would validate a picture of a paper document. (I believe RC once had such an expert on his radio show who said that.) They need to examine the paper document.
As for the CT SSN, what happens if you misskey the zip? Anything? How about the zip 96814 as 06814?
Feel free to send over some of your colleagues who have “run” Obama’s documents for serious academic discussions. Your research seems a bit flawed. (Examples — African American being on a document, 1981 being the date of the literary agent’s publication.)
Not neessarily. As I have posted before, my ex-wife’s SSN is 210-xx-xxxx and she has never lived or worked in Pennsylvania. How did that happen? Who knows? Does it mean that she stole her SSN from someone else? Of course not.
Thanks for the entertainment Seamus, and your perfect, spot on exhibit A performance, for this class of “Intro To Birthers”.
Really? There isn’t a single law enforcement records expert or forensic document expert who hasn’t “run” the Obama documents? I had no idea that thousands of experts have had so much time on their hands, and how few of them have mentioned their work on Obama.
If Obama stole someone’s SSN, it should be easy enough for your law enforcement experts and forensic documents experts to tell us who he stole the SSN from. Give us a name and some evidence that someone other than Barack Obama has ever use that SSN. If you can.
Have you examined the rebuttal evidence by Frank Arduini, John Woodman, and others? The evidence that shows a human didn’t forge the documents, but rather machine algorithms triggered by scanning and saving the original? How about expert reports from Ivan Zatkovich of eComp Consulting, Jon Berryhill of Berryhill Computer Forensics, Dr. Neal Krawetz, publisher of HackerFactor.com, Nathan Goulding, the Chief Technology Officer of The National Review Online, and others?
Surely you’ve examined all sides of the issue.
I notice the job description talks about the applicant needing “interpersonal skills; oral and written communication skills”. Me thinks he has failed on those counts.
No certified forensic document expert has EVER testified under oath in a court of law in any of the 226 legal challenges to President Obama’s eligibility.
No forensic document expert has EVER examined the original, vault copy Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Obama which resides in the office safe of Dr. Alvin T. Onaka, the Registrar of Vital Statistics of the state of Hawaii.
I’m still trying to figure out how a forensic documents expert would be able to validate someone’s Social Security Number.
You’d think with your 27 years of experience you would know that the name of the department is Department of Correction.
Smugly? You mean he told a joke about you guys claiming he wrote it and saying you should help him collect royalties? You guys are so serious in your stupidity you can’t tell when people are shining you on anymore.
Are you always this gullible?
You teach ’em how to work the Polaroid and the laminator, and the proper sequence for storing the folders in the cabinets? It’s obvious that that you have nothing to do with document forensics, since you’ve made multiple mistakes that even a student of the field wouldn’t.
Just another troll, less illiterate than usual, but no smarter.
Where did anyone say that? Has SSA ever acknowledged your claim? When Susan Daniels made the same claim they denied every single one of her claims as having a factual basis.
Where was he listed as African American in 1961?
You really aren’t a very good birther, really not up on your material.
1. You’re confused, mistaking Obama’s father being listed as “African” on the President’s birth certificate for the President being listed as “African American.” In fact Obama’s race is not on his birth certificate at all.
2. You think that African American wasn’t common in 1961, but in fact the 1961 federal vital statistics manual specifically instructs data entry operators what to enter with the race is Afro-American or A. A.
I don’t think you have what it takes to make the birther team.
Seamus, on three occasions the State of Hawaii has officially verified that the birth certificate posted on Whithouse.gov is legitimate and accurate. End of story.
The State of Hawaii is the only legal entity that could assert it was forged and yet they have done the exact opposite. You have no where to go from there.
“I don’t think you have what it takes to make the birther team.”
Seamus was up with the Birthers’ major league team for a cup of coffee during Spring Training but he’s been sent down to the rookie league team now that the (universe shattering) regular season is starting.
Our commenter Saul Alinsky and Seamus are the same person.
I think all that time on top of the car roof has taken its toll.
Here are links to the three Certified Letters of Verification for President Obama’s Certificate of Live Birth that were issued by the ahawaii state Registrar of Vital Statistics:
Arizona: http://archive.azcentral.com/12news/Obama-Verification.pdf
Kansas: http://www.scribd.com/mobile/doc/106576604
Mississippi: http://www.scribd.com/mobile/doc/96289285
Did that Saul Alinsky make any interesting claims? Sigh. Another troll. Sadly, I had such hopes for Seamus. But he floundered.
As I’ve mentioned here before, my social security number would indicate it was issued in New York. I have never lived or worked in New York, although I have been there. My residence has always been in Indiana. My first job was for the family farm and food processing business, and my Grandmother provided me with the application so she could report my wages.
My wife’s social security number indicates it is from Wisconsin. In her case, her first job was at a summer camp in Wisconsin. It is possible that is why, but she has always resided in Indiana. We don’t know and don’t care.
Seamus dear
Now since you are such an in depth researcher, you of course are aware that Mike Zullo himself stated in a Gallups call in that he approached over 200 document forensic experts who all passed before he found a graphologist, Reed Hayes.
Oh and this graphologist doesn’t actually have either of the two professional certifications you mention and his report has as if by magic never seen the light of day….
So , you were saying about how every expert has seen and opined..?
I find it endlessly fascinating that imbeciles like Seamus harp for yours about details that even if there were true (which they aren’t) are ultimately totally irrelevant to Obama’s performance as president.
As Glenn Greenwald has demonstrated there are plenty of solid reasons to attack Obama. But idiots like Seamus have to obsess about a SS number!
A challenge to all the birthers.
April 15th approaches. If you have the courage of your convictions that the President is using an invalid SSN, you will file our taxes with a made up SSN. When it flies through this will prove your point. I’m sure it will work out well for you.
Otherwise, shut up.
That’s precisely what makes him a perfect birfer. It’s specifically this kind of arrogant ignorance that drives the evolution of birfer memes. They adamantly get their own material wrong, other proto-birfers come along and lap up their vomit, and propagate the mutated brain worms.
The simplest example is the “Obama spent $XX million concealing his records” bit. So many different numbers being asserted. And they’re all equally correct 😉
alg
“The State of Hawaii is the only legal entity that could assert it was forged and yet they have done the exact opposite. You [Seamus] have no where to go from there.”
Zullo has nowhere to go with this as well. The evidence would suggest that Zullo has ulterior motives for conducting his investimagination.
Because they’re not in the business of validating photocopies. That’s a no brainer. Hand them a paper copy with the raised seal, and you have another story. But than again, every single one passed on the opportunity to get paid to give an opinion on the documents. I wonder why? Oh yeah…because you don’t give opinions about photocopies of documents you’re trying to determine the validity of. That is reality.
The Mike Zullo presentaiton was a series of birther claims that had been debunked long before he made his first presser. Then he proceeded to give more pressers that contained “evidence” that was quickly proven to be misrepresented by him (the race codes from different years). But hey…feel free to rely on debunked b.s. of amatuers.
As been said…no such thing as a Connecticut ssn, we really don’t know why his biographer put him as born in Kenya, but it wasn’t the only error on the bio sheet (they put the wrong years for Newt’s tenture in congress), and the president’s race didn’t appear on the birth certificate (it was his father’s), it didn’t say African American, (it said African), and that would have been probably how he identified himself (and it was self reporting). It’s hard enough to take birthers seriously, but you cant even get the basic facts straight.
Any day now….been hearing that for years, and you guys have well over 200 losses in court now. Boy who cried wolf?
And of course you can provide a link to document that.
And Seamus/Alinsky didn’t pose much of a challenge. It’s as easy as shooting your hunting companion in the face.
Actually, both allegations are complete bulls***. And they’re well-known, point-by-point proven, analyzed-to-death, warmed-over, 12th-time reheated bulls***.
There’s plenty of rock-solid documentation for that, if you could be bothered with it. Tons of it now. But you’re a birther, or a troll, or both, so…
You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t give him the IQ of a real person.
I used to think that if allegations were clearly shown to be total, absolute, clear-as-day BS, that would sort of kill them off. Well, I guess it sort of did. Real birthers such as yourself now almost as rare as talking chimpanzees.
But, there are still a few left out there, who will never rise, who haven’t the faintest hope of rising, to the level of any real understanding.
Maybe because he doesn’t have a “Stolen Social Security number”, and both his COLB and long form have been (repeatedly) verified as accurate by the State of Hawaii. Oh, and that nobody with any actual forensic document experience has ever said the COLB or long form images were “poorly done forgeries”
But keep flogging the birther myths and lies.
Let’s see:
Incorrect. It is a belief, based upon records from a source that states the information may not be correct, and provided from an “investigator” who is rather biased. No credible evidence has ever been provided to back this claim up.
Again, opinion, not fact. No credible evidence has ever been provided to back these claims up. None of the “experts” who have made such a claim have forensic document experience or training. Several (such as “Techdude” and Ron Polland / “Polarik”) have flat out lied about their background and training. Other “experts” are a person who practices the pseudo-science of handwriting analysis, a copier salesman who writes about Pyramid Power and Mystery Spots, a retired typesetter who claimed an anonymous “Secret Service Agent” told him it was a forgery before it was released, and a former Hillary Clinton supporter who wrote books about Photoshop ten years ago.
O RLY??
http://health.hawaii.gov/vitalrecords/faq-obama/
Then you shouldn’t have any problems showing real and credible evidence from actual certified and trained forensic experts to back up these “pure facts”, correct?
For some strange reason, I get the very strong smell of bovine excrement reading this.
After all, it’s not like birthers have a tendency to make up claims like this before (such as Ron Polland / Polarik claiming to be a forensic document specialist before it was found his background is a Ph.D. in “instructional media”
Funny, the State of Hawaii, along with the Secretary of States for Arizona and Kansas, seemed to have no problems……
And yet, curiously enough, none of those actual experts have come out and said anything of the sort, leaving the field wide open to a batch of uncertified, untrained, wannabe “experts”. If it was really as unanimous and widespread at these “seminars and symposiums” as you claim, then one would have expected SOMEONE to have spoken out in six+ years……
Then again, considering you can’t even get the name of the organization that you claim to work at correct, one might come to the conclusion that you’re absolutely lying though your teeth.
Actually this is an interesting example of birther inflation. “Seamus”:
1) Makes the comment that it’s “pure fact” that President Obama’s documents are forgeries and that the State of Hawaii has never confirmed them.
When it’s shown to be otherwise, he then goes to:
2) A claim that he works for the “Ct. Department of Corrections” (not it’s real name) as a “id and records specialist”.
Which is now inflated to the above claim.
I expect “Seamus” will make more and more gracious and wild claims about his skill, background, training, etc., until people get tired of batting him around like a cat toy. At which point he’ll scuttle off to Birther Report or Free Republic to claim “victory”
Silly Obot. Everyone knows who Alinsky is. He’s the inventor of political sarcasm. It did not exist until he taught Left Wing Commies how to use it to attack the oh-so-reasonable arguments of those middle-of-the-road bipartisan folks like Ted Cruz and Sarah Palin.
Oh, and since Republicans would never stoop to using sarcasm, all sarcasm can be justifiably referred to as Alinsky attacks.
You mean the SSN that Dr. Orly and friends spammed all over the internet from hell to breakfast??
It’s funny, but Social Security Administration does have a procedure to change one’s SSN number to help prevent identity theft
https://faq.ssa.gov/ics/support/KBAnswer.asp?questionID=1823
I kind of doubt that a records specialist with the DOC has any need to attend a conference where he would have contact with a number of document examiners. Records specialists do records management, which is an important but entirely different function.
http://ct.gov/doc/cwp/view.asp?a=1496&q=270784
…actually live in stunned awe of their own presumed intellect.
I’m actually convinced that an unreasonably large number of these people are 23-year-old losers shacked up with whatever girl they found who would put up with them.
As Mr. Obama does NOT have a stole SS number or a fake birth certificate, there is no explanation needed. The ONLY explanation needed is the legal verification of its existence from the state of HI. That has been explanation enough for every judge in over 200 cases, including the Supreme Court.
Looks like the our new chew toy ran away. Shocking.
Sorry, I peg them as middle-aged white men living in their mother’s basements. No other gal will have them.
$31.62 an hour for a glorified clerk?????????
I’m waiting for him to show up at Free Republic or Birther Report, and claim victory., that nobody could refute his “solid facts”
At the top end. $23.31 at the low end for an RS1 in CT. I think correctional facilities tend to pay fairly well overall. It’s not a work environment that many people find very attractive.
And, if they do, you probably don’t want them working there.
Today’s 23yr olds are still living with their parents. They hate Obama for being a sell-out, not being left enough.
Birfers are older, often very old, frequently retired and rotting their minds on cable ‘news’ and junk websites.
These patterns are so predictable, it’s not much fun anymore.
One trend that’s catching on now is espousing contrarian views of Lincoln while peddling Southern apologia. The material is 150 years old, but the wingnuts seem to find it fresh and exciting.
The South will rise again. Cough. Cough.
Not here in Okieland they don’t. Just think—you can has all the depression, with none of the remuneration! Yay!!!
Also mistaken, Seamus, is your belief that anyone who doubts the birthers is far left. Haven’t you been paying attention? T here is no left left.
I’ve posted this here before:
My mom got her SSN probably in the early ’40s, when she lived in either Minnesota or Wisconsin. The SSA give her an Iowa number.
My husband got his SSN in the late ’60s. Although he lived in Iowa, he received a Minnesota number.
When I saw the question about Obama’s SSN, I looked at the SSN’s that I knew – my parents, mine, and my husband’s. 50% of them were from an “incorrect” state!
Impervious to fact Seamus is. Thinks that merely declaring something to be true with enough gall will cause people who disagree to surrender.
Birtherism in a nutshell.
I don’t believe that the assignment of numbers is via clerks. Logic dictates that since we are living in the actual age of computers, all clerks to is enter the application information into the digital system and sometime during the day, if not immediately, the computer assigns the number to the applicant. Last I checked, computers don’t make clerical errors, so if at the time Obama supposedly applied for the number, they were in fact assigned by computer based on zip code, then Obama has some ‘splainin to do if doubts are to be resolved.
[Computers don’t make clerical errors, but computers in 1977 relied on humans for data entry. Humans make data entry errors, like mis-keying a zip code. Are you really that dense? Doc.]
If you would, please point to an expert that has “debunked” the spacing impossibility of the Obama document, -or even addressed it. That would be necessary to fully lay to rest the doubts about its authenticity.
It is intellectually dishonest to pretend that the debunking of the layers anomaly debunks all other issues when they are still there, begging for explanation. Which does not exist aside from the explanation of digital manipulation.
[It is intellectually dishonest to claim that layers are all that have been debunked. It’s all been debunked. But the basic fallacy you make is ignoring the fact that no expert has said that there is anything wrong with the spacing in the first place. Rather than demanding an expert debunk the spacing, perhaps you should first come up with an expert that even makes the claim that something is wrong. And please don’t cite Irey. The fact that he used a typewriter to make a newsletter decades ago does not qualify him as an expert. Doc.]
No one has examined the ORIGINAL, vault edition, hard copy Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Hussein Obama, II. That document resides in the office safe of the Hawaii state Registrar of Vital Statistics, Dr. Alvin T. Onaka who has issued three Certified Letters of Verification for the original, hard copy of the Vital Record of Birth.
Why don’t you and Apuzzo just go back to argueing which one of you is more right about the NBC crap you’re both out to lunch on?
The PDF is irrelevant, period. Obama could have copied it in crayon on wax paper, and ironed it to the white house windows and it still would not have been an issue.
The PDF issue has been settled. It was settled with empirical data, but as others have stated, since the PDF is not admissible evidence, it was done purely to put you idiots in your place.
Now, don’t you have a neo-nazi rally to be getting to?
You know, you really should give that fact some thought. You are aware that Zullo paid Reed his usual fee, right? His work wasn’t pro bono. So… why the heck did 200 other examiners turn down a paid assignment that came knocking on their door?
Nobody turns down easy money when it is tied to the most crucial document known to man. Why they must have been out of their minds!
No, they were very much IN their minds but very much feeling an awful dread about what they might find.
Long ago I read about a physics researcher who was doing calculations regarding Space-Time. He eventually had to stop working on it because he reached the point where he felt he was “about to look over a wall into the face of God”.
That was just the kind of fear that “persuaded” all of those many examiners to reject a most desirable assignment, Reed was the only one who felt no sense of concern and thus took it.
[While I am not certain, I have read that Hayes went to Zullo, not the other way around. We only have Mike Zullo’s word that 200 document analysts turned him down. And if the number is true, given the fact that there are very few experts in electronic documents, it’s reasonable that most or all of them turned him down because he didn’t have an original document. And of course WorldNetDaily hired three analysts (Pex, Broyhill and Zatkovich) to examine the long form with no difficulty (all found no problems).
So you won’t waste your time, I’m deleting most of your stuff on general principles, because you’re banned from the site. Doc.]
Isn’t begging the question an intellectually dishonest debate tactic?
Did he become a priest? Did he walk the land, telling of his revelation???
DON’T LEAVE ME HANGING, MAN, I’M LOVING THIS STORY!!!
Oh, well. Maybe my fundie aunt will send me a chain email to tell me how it ends.
That’s a good point; I remember how Woodward and Bernstein were vilified for uncovering a conspiracy and were never heard from again. They should have minded their own beeswax.
probably because no document expert is going to risk his name and reputation by getting involved with a bunch of conspiracy nuts with a PDF that he can’t do anything with.
Real professionals value their reputation over “easy money”
fox mulder: “[God] may well have His reasons, but He seems to use a lot of psychotics to carry out His job orders.”
As opposed to a certain graphologist in Hawaii.
Doc said
I don’t think that is correct. I think Zullo said that Hayes did not want to do the analysis at first but Zullo sent him the PDF and asked him to take a look at it and after 30 minutes Hayes concluded something wasn’t right. Of course extra money might have been involved.
Does it make sense that Zullo would have to send the PDF to Hayes?
Was he not aware of the controversy? Had he not even peeked???
If that’s their story it stinks.
Interesting, another pop-up birther to entertain the regulars. Must be getting desperate after the Alabama ruling.
C’mon, give’em the benefit of the doubt. I mean, he’s wayyyyy out in Hawaii, right? No reason at all to be particularly aware of this controversy back, on the mainland. 😉
Correct.
But not because they find that the documents are suspicious.
Its because they don’t have access to the appropriate documents to examine AND they have not been engaged to examine any appropriate documents that they can access. PDF’s are NOT appropriate for that examination.
Since you seem to be able to breathe and type at the same time (yes, I am making a heap of assumptions there) I have to assume that you have enough ‘smarts’ to know the difference between a computer file containing an image of a document in PDF format and the original document itself.
I therefore must conclude that you are either intellectually dishonest, a pathological attention seeker, or simply a shill for some dirty tricks shop that’s throwing you a bone every now and again.
Or maybe all three at once.
Your line of argument is getting very old and very boring.
Minor elaboration: Obama Junior’s race is not on the certificate. His father’s is listed as ‘African’ (certainly not ‘African American’).
You are probably correct. We’re bored with your stuff. Troll comes on to stir up trouble and we are just bored enough to take his bait.
Doesn’t change the fact of your failure, it just speaks to the complete inanity of your argument.
You mean Rosie Palm and her five sisters?
It took me ffoorreevveerr to remember that Rosie Palm euphimism. I even had to look it up on Mr. Wikipedia; it is that long since I’ve been in 7th grade.
Anyway on the way look it up I came across this one which I’d never heard and thought it was absolutely appropriate:
You may have read it when I posted it here once or twice.
Zullo did a sit-down video interview with someone in which he mentioned:
1. They had tried 212 experts of some sort or other (he might have been more specific than their being “document” experts, but I’m pretty sure that that was as specific as he got. I’m 99% sure he did _not_ call them “electronic document” experts) who turned them down.
2. He considered it good luck that Hayes had come to them. I’m about 80% sure that he did _not_ say how. Maybe Hayes was working a case for Phoenix PD, and some detective said “You should talk to this guy Zullo: he thinks he’s on to something big”. Or maybe he was looking for movie times, and google changed his mistyped “Zorro” into “Zullo” because the name was in the news that day (shrug).
3. Hayes was initially not going to get involved, but changed his mind after looking at (something which may, or may not, have been identified in the interview).
I’m fairly certain I saw the video by following a link on youtube. And it probably would’ve been mid-to-late 2012, because he mentioned the “African Anachronism”. If anyone cares enough to fill in the fuzzy spots in my memory, I’d suggest starting the search there.
I’m 99% sure that Hayes only documented ‘expertise’ is in divining personality from handwriting.
Actually, RC wrote an article last year about Hayes being a member of NADE: http://rcradioblog.wordpress.com/2013/07/17/did-reed-hayes-violate-the-nade-code-of-ethics/
But it does seem to be unclear exactly what sort of “examinations” they’ve certified him on. Could be just signature authentication, could be more.
NADE has no certification in electronic documents.